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This topic contains 22 replies, has 7 voices, and was last updated by  Kaosubaloo 6 years, 7 months ago.

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  • #22698

    Trent
    Participant

    Ok, the new world has not been online for long, and already I’ve noticed a few things that vex me. Several tendencies have carried over from the old server, and I’d like to nip them in the butt. Little annoyances that are within all our power to change and help the server live up to it’s ‘awesome’ moniker.

    So I submit to our little community a few etiquette rules to help improve everyone’s experience. These are not really meant to be enforced, or official rules of the server by any means (“No griefing” for example, would be an official rule; punishable if broken. These are more suggestions, like saying please and thank you). Feel free to discuss the issues that I, or others, raise – as well as add your own rules. If you do have anything to add, please keep examples as anonymous as possible, this is not the place to call out each other for poor etiquette.

    New forums, and I feel this topic cannot be emphasized enough. It deserves new life. Much of this is copied and pasted from the old thread, although I’ve added one or two.

    Without further ado;

    1) When collecting lumber, please try to get the entire tree. A forest full of hovering tree-tops just looks silly, and should be avoided (unless it’s part of your build). I’m not saying to manually remove all the leaves – just after you mine the visible portions of the trunk, look up and punch/axe the remaining wood within the leaves. Leaf decay will take care of the rest.

    So if you do not have the patience to remove all the wood from one of the large oaks/conifers, which may involve building a temporary column to get up higher. Please instead opt to cut down one of their smaller nearby cousins. … which leads us to;

    2) Please replant. Unless whatever you are building necessitates the permanent removal of a (section of/entire) forest, take a few minutes after collecting wood to spread a few saplings around. You don’t have to plant them in the same place, or even follow the original density of the trees. Just make an effort to replant some of them – that forest may have been someone’s back-yard, and they may prefer the forest to open grassland. (and each tree on average drops more than enough saplings to replace it’s self, so there’s no excuse)

    Similarly, when collecting things like cactus and reeds from the wild, try to leave the bottom block intact. The top will grow back, and the resource will be available to the next person looking for some in the area.

    This also goes for crops – harvesting wheat/nether wart produces more than enough seeds to replant everything and still have seeds leftover. Pumpkins/Melons will regrow from the same stalk, but if you accidentally destroy that? plant a seed!

    3) If you’ve built up a column of [whatever] in order to get a better view of something, for a screenshot, or even to explore where you can’t normally travel, please remove them afterwards. Several of these columns dotting the landscape, and it just starts to look stupid and lazy. To better facilitate their removal after their use has ended, it may be a great idea to build them out of sand or gravel. If you fell off of one not built out of easily removable materials, you can build a second one right next to it, stand on the line between them, and remove both columns at the same time.

    These columns are also often used when exploring new lands – they provide an easy to follow guide to where you were before you died, or even to find your way back to where you started from. That said, once they’ve outlived their usefulness (you’re connected to a main road/rail/nether), please take them down. Again, to better facilitate this, it is advisable to construct then from sand/gravel.

    If you are using them to claim/mark territory, a good idea might be to add a sign to them, so others know what they mean.

    4) ASK. Along the lines of what Kristin posted; Ask. Nine times out of ten, if I have a resource in my chests you want/need, I’ll probably give you some of it. Heck, if I don’t immediately need it and I can replenish in short order, you can take the whole stack. But for the love of [deity], ASK!

    And just in case this is not clear to some (who am I kidding, to any of us that care enough about the server to be on these forums, this doesn’t have to be spelled out); that means if the owner of the chest is not online, and there is no sign indicating you are free to take what you want; chests are strictly “look, but don’t take“. (and, really, you probably shouldn’t even look. Someone comes up behind you and sees an open chest infront of you… doesn’t look good.)

    5) Nether Etiquette. Sadly, Minecraft often just plain sucks at placing placing portals. And it doesn’t work like some people assume it does. Gates are not linked by any kind Of ID system wherein over-world gate ‘o42’ is always linked to nether gate ‘n42’. Gates work PURELY off of the coordinate system.

    When you create, activate, and travel through a new gate in the over-world, Minecraft attempts to place a corresponding gate in the nether, but the ideal location is more often than not in the middle of solid rock, mid-air, or a pool of lava. The game then starts looking outwards for an existing gate that is close enough, or generates a new gate at the closest ideal location. This generated gate is often so far from the propper coordinates, that going back through it? it can’t find an overworld gate at its corresponding location. So IT creates a NEW gate in the overworld. likely out in the middle of bum-fuck nowhere, or in a random cave.

    So! best practices;

    A) Before stepping through a new gate;

    -a1) Ensure you have at least a diamond pick, a lighter, 10 obsidian, and a sign.
    -a2) Press F3, and take note of your X and Z coordinates (example -> [-1234x, 654z])

    B) Stepping through;

    -b1) Determine if you came through someone else’s portal. A generated portal will be square and use 14 obsidian. But look for signs that this may be part of someone’s nether-base.
    -b2) If there are no signs of it belonging to someone else, take your pickaxe to the obsidian of the portal and remove one block to disrupt the portal. (or take it all! free obsidian!)

    C) The way back (machine);

    -c1) take those coordinate readings from a2 and divide them by 8 (example -> [-154x, 82z]). This is where you need to build the connecting gate.
    -c2) getting to that location may involve digging into netherrack, or building a platform over lava
    -c3) once the location is reached and the new portal constructed, place the sign on or near your portal. This will inform other users who built a new over-world gate that connected to yours, that this is yours, and it should not be destroyed
    -c4) step through. You should now be back in the over world next to the gate you originally entered.

    D) Congratulations! your base now has a foothold in the nether!

    6) Nether Fortresses. Hey, I get it; you want Netherbrick, and short of asking a mod or someone with creative, the only way to get it is to take it from these places. That is fine. But mining willy-nilly all over the place just turns them into swiss-cheese, creating falling hazards (often into lava) and giving ghasts a clear line of sight. Also, it just ends up looking stupid.

    First – Take a good hard look at a nether fortress. See how it doesn’t just hang in the air? see the supports? Those are pure solid netherbrick, and they reach from the fortress down to netherrack. Hollow those bad boys out! keep a stack of netherrack on you to get back up, and depending on the height of the supports, this can net you several stacks. Per. Support. Heck, some of the main rooms don’t even have ‘supports’ they’re just solid all the way down to the ground.

    Second – Also note that in many areas the ceilings and walls can be a few blocks thick. Instead of taking out the entire thing, just mine out the inside, leaving the outer shell intact. Some fortresses are massive, just dropping the floor by one and raising the ceilings by one will likely net you more than enough for your projects.

    Third – Start disassembling the Ramparts – each netherfortress typically consists of two separate sections The first consists of large solid rooms with walls and ceilings, the second is more spread out, and often more open-air. Although if it intersects with solid netherrack it will hollow out areas to make paths. Often these ramparts end abruptly, so what would it hurt if you shortened their length a little? (this area also has supports to hollow out)

    7) You are smarter than a dinosaur, go the fsuck around! I want to believe this is just the work of griefers. But sometimes I wonder if, occasionally, it is a few of our regulars who, like the dinosaur in that clip from Sesame Street, should just go extinct. Seriously, whether the nearest exit or entrance to a structure is 10, or 200 meters away – use it. And if, for the sake of argument, it’s a life or death situation and you MUST exit through the wall… Put the damn wall back where it was! (And if there is no entrance/exit? Then the creator doesn’t want you in anyway.)

    #22703

    Spacevagrant
    Participant

    I thought this was a good idea on the old forums and still do so here. We really need a list of rules so people know what not to do so they won’t get banned and a system in place so if you do get banned and feel that it really is unjust you know where to go and who to talk to.

    #22704

    Kaosubaloo
    Participant

    The Golden Rule: Don’t be a Dick

     

    Violate this rule and you are liable to get your ass banned. Obey it and you’ll probably not rule into trouble with the rest of them in the first place.

    Guess who, it's Kaosubaloo!

    #22705

    Trent
    Participant

    Just remembered…

    8 ) Don’t go too far out. Yes, we all like to build our wonderful/large stuff away from spawn. Partially as a defense against griefers, partially to ensure enough room for what we want to build without stepping on the toes of others. But we ran into a problem on the server’s old world… after a certain distance mapping tools just can’t process generating an image large enough to get the entire world.

    So, let’s try not going beyond 10,000 meters in any direction. There’s really no reason to go any further. And let’s not all rush to generate terrain within that limit, give some room for any new stuff that’s added (like the semi-recent jungles). I’d say 20,000 is absolute max anyone should reasonably be going, but I’d like to keep that in reserve, lest we get too used to THAT and push out further yet.

    What does this mean for the nether? well, 10,000/8=1,250. So please, no portals beyond 1,250 meters in any direction in the nether. This is a bit more restrictive, but if you plan to build a large-scale thing in the nether beyond this distance please at the very least put the portal within this limit. you can then add in a private rail-track or something between your portal and build.

    If you have already built outside of these limits, that’s fine, just please go no further away from 0x,0z.

    9) Avoid building with lava within roughly 1000 meters of spawn. “Can’t griefers mine down to lava or take a quick trip to the nether?” yes. But this is a loose rule of thumb we’ve developed after experiences on our first map. Things near spawn are always prime targets for griefing, and having lava sources out in the open that close to spawn is just asking for trouble. And lava is annoying as hell to clean up (it doesn’t decay as cleanly as water). Doesn’t matter how hard the source-block is to get at; They will get at it, bucket it, and pour it on something.

    Side note; as we have new spawn and old spawn now, I’d say within ~1000 meters of both.

    This isn’t STRICTLY enforced, but lawmen will remove such lava as they see fit (and should be leaving signs when they do so)

    #22711

    ViralDemon
    Participant

    It’s a bit late for the 10,000 meter thing considering the jungle warp is way past that.

    #22714

    Trent
    Participant

    In all likelihood, junglewarp is that far out because it was needed to generate a jungle biome – which is fine. Those didn’t exist at server creation (or for a month or two afterwards). What I’m saying is avoid going much further out. There is no reason to go further out; If some griefer’s going to walk eight kilometers out to get to something, they’ll just as easily go four thousand more meters.

    If you go further out, it’s further we’d have to go LATER to spawn NEW biomes/blocks naturally. And it all culminates in we can’t map the server. AGAIN. (Speaking of, I think we’re due for a new map, no? Last time the FOA was barely built/still under construction)

    and it’s not a hard inflexible limit. It’s just a guideline – IE don’t be the guy that goes all the way to 100,000X, 100,000z. As Kaosubaloo put it “The Golden Rule: Don’t be a Dick“. (Also, not blaming whomever did it on the old server… I doubt anyone really understood the mapping consequences until it was too late.)

    #22725

    Raven
    Member

    There’s a pretty nifty Jungle/Desert island in the ocean past Brandon’s unfinished adminium fortress thing, and I’m sure it’s within 4k of spawn…

    But ultimately, I’m confident there must be some server administration plugin that allows to literally wall up the server at any desired distance. So if we do not want people to go beyond 10k or 20k in any direction, it is surely possible to put up nice giant invisible borders to secure our desired map size until updates dictate that we expand.

    Heck, it might even be possible to flat out tell the server to not generate chunks past a given distance, leaving the void as the ultimate vision quest deterrent.

    All the fun parts of life are optional.

    #23347

    Flawedspirit
    Participant

    Borderguard. You can designate the radius of either a circular or square area. Players can’t go past that through any means, save one: the Nether. You’ll have to set another border within the nether of Main World Border Radius / 8.

    Despite what my username says, I am certifiably flawless.
    Please echo "all complaints and suggestions" > /dev/null.

    #23355

    Kaosubaloo
    Participant

    I’m sorry but I’m not really sure what you’re saying Flawed. Care to elaborate?

    Guess who, it's Kaosubaloo!

    #23383

    Kaosubaloo
    Participant

    Here’s a new one that came up: Reserving a future build site is okay for a short period of time, but you should NOT try to reserve an area of land to sell it or to deny others from using it.

    In other words, if you are reserving an area to do something OTHER then building, you should probably not be reserving it.

    I would ALSO like to point out that things like this do not have loopholes. It hurts me that I need to specify this but it is not a hard-cut rule where this side is okay and this side is not. If you doing something that follows the word of Server Etiquette but breaks the spirit then you are in the wrong. The reverse is also true, but tends to come up far, FAR less often.

    Guess who, it's Kaosubaloo!

    #23389

    Raven
    Member

    You do not understand. You are seeing as some sort of rule something that entirely depends on a consensus between concerned players. If player A is willing to settle a plot and player B is willing to buy it with resources, it is not your business to come in and tell them in the chat that they cannot. 🙄

    All the fun parts of life are optional.

    #23390

    Kaosubaloo
    Participant

    Okay, 2 things here. The first one is that I am using the term rule loosely here. That is ambiguity entirely on my part so I’m sorry for the misunderstanding there. My bad.

    Second of all and much more important is why it IS my business to stop someone from fencing on a completely arbitrary and random piece of land and then “sell” it to another player. If we allow someone to do it then it creates all sorts or potentially bad scenarios, most of which involve victimizing new players. Our server is full of free space, unclaimed and unused. Functionally infinite in fact. However a new player does not necessarily know this. This player could easily be tricked into thinking that in order to build anywhere required purchasing land to do it. And hell, around spawn, that could easily become the case. As it ALSO opens the door to having a dozen players all move out to reserve HUGE chunks of land they otherwise don’t give a shit about just so they can sell it to someone else who might want it in the future.

    In short, it is important to establish that if someone wants to build somewhere, you SHOULDN’T be stopping them from doing it unless you plan on building there yourself (or have already done so).

    Guess who, it's Kaosubaloo!

    #23391

    Trent
    Participant

    Personally, I’m of the opinion that if, say, you are building an entire town, yes you can reserve plots of land for sale. As long as your boarders were set up ahead of time.

    BUT, in the specific example that was argued on the server this evening, I do not find this ok in an area like spawn-town. What’s to stop me, right now as I type this, from distributing signs along the entire area? Nothing. Spawn town is supposed to be a public place to build as one pleases. If you were to build a shop and hang a sign that said the building was for sale, that’s one thing (and what someone did with the building after purchase is their business), but to just arbitrarily claim plots of land you have no intention to develop IN A PUBLIC TOWN like spawn town is wrong.

    And I will now end all future debates of this sort.

    I hereby claim all the undeveloped land around spawn. You may lease, for the price of zilch, any parcel of this land to build on. You may sell the buildings that you so build on my land, but the land is mine and cannot be resold for profit. As the landlord I will deal with abuses of my land as I see fit.

    Done. Can’t claim land in this manner? then others cant claim the land in such a fashion either. Can? Then it’s mine.

    #23394

    Raven
    Member

    Take a note that I still consider the outrage to be a storm in a cup of water for something that amounts to roleplay between the newbies. Extreme scenarios are just that: extreme. No one in the relevant future is going to go up and fence large tracts of virgin land unless we go do it as part of this argument to prove a point. And no one is going to trick new players, jeez. What they’re doing is finding nice plots around town and bartering them off to each other. It’s cute. You are overreacting to something limited to the new town, that doesn’t affect you outside of hearing about it in chat tonight.

    And for some reason that shouldn’t be because it doesn’t affect me either, strongharming them out of doing it with a flat “no, don’t do that because slippery slope” grates on my nerves. I’ve played along the new guys in New Spawn all week long. They’re harmless. They’re cute to watch buzz around. They’ve done so much around there, more functional, interesting stuff than what there ever was next to Old Spawn. We regulars shouldn’t be laying commands based on what we like or not on their fun.

    And I hereby conquer Trent’s lands by right of pigeon.

    All the fun parts of life are optional.

    #23395

    Kaosubaloo
    Participant

    I am willing to agree to disagree. I did forget to add a very important part to my original post though:

    That land is in this context something that should always be free and charging people for it (or indeed anything that should *always* be free) is something that should always be shut down. #opinion

    Guess who, it's Kaosubaloo!

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